Talk:Culture of Canada

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2012

Article has been updated as of Feb. If you would like to help = Pls make sure the spelling of English words consistent with Canadian spelling. Also a copy edit by a third party would be good. As per the norm pls make sure refs are ok.Moxy (talk) 05:28, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

"Over time" the culture was influenced by aboriginals?

This is not worded well. The cultural mixing began immediately, with Champlain himself living with aboriginals, and intermarriage or cohabitation happening from the start. The Quebec legislature's face is covered with reliefs indicating this mixing of New and Old World cultures and peoples. There were few French women in Canada until much later than Champlain's day, when the Filles du Roy were sent to counter the trend towards Quebec becoming a metis culture with divided loyalties. The most quintessential Canadian traits and traditions are often Aboriginal in origin: things like snowshoes, canoeing, lacrosse, hunting and fishing, the outdoors and survival ethos present in most literature and much artwork, and some have argued deeply held attitudes regarding consensus, multiculturalism, medicine, collectivism, egalitarianism. I'm writing this as a non-aboriginal, Canadian high school teacher with an M.A. degree. When I studied Canadian history, and I studied a lot of it, the native peoples were about a quarter of the story! Even English Canada was founded and preserved from American conquest by an alliance between the British and the Iroquois, with Joseph Brant the Iroquois Haudenosaunee leader being memorialized all over Southern Ontario. Even the Loyalists were primarily Americans, bringing with them a culture already influenced for hundreds of years by interaction (both hostile and peaceable) with Amerindians. The Prairie provinces of Saskatchewan and Manitoba were founded by a metis leader who later led a rebellion and was executed. Even today, geographically speaking, the native languages of Cree, Inuktituk, and Ojibwe cover an enormous area where they are the predominant tongues.Kozushi (talk) 05:09, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Your change seems reasonable.Moxy (talk) 18:31, 13 November 2012 (UTC)

Gun control

An editor was attempting to remove gun control as a part of Canadian culture in the lead section. This section is sourced. Once that was explained, the editor has turned to replacing the statement with its opposite, that there are 2 millions gun owners in Canada, using a statistic as a source. The problem is, the paragraph in question is discussing Canada's reputation as progressive and lists items considered progressive, same-sex marriage, gun control and so on. This is sourced. Throwing in some information about gun ownership makes no sense in the context of this paragraph and as well, it is original research as the only source given is a statistic. Just because this editor claims that gun ownership is part of Canadian culture does not make it so. If there are published sources that convey gun ownership as a part of Canadian identity or that the claiming of progressive causes as Canadian identity is flawed, this can be added to the article if written properly. But just adding an editor's own POV because he doesn't like something is not the way to go. He has been warned about disruptive editing and edit warring but edits from different IP addresses. freshacconci talktalk 15:12, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

See ongoing talk at Talk:Canada#Culture section and strict gun control - IP is making assumptions based on stats not RS. They must also understand what the statement says - social indicators of Canada's political and cultural values. Moxy (talk) 15:40, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

• Norman L. Lunger (2002). Big Bang: The Loud Debate Over Gun Control. Twenty-First Century Books. p. 119. ISBN 978-0-7613-2260-3. U.S. gun-rights activists found it hard to understand Canadians' acquiescence to such far-reaching gun controls. ... To many Canadians, the nation's strict gun controls are a prime reason why gun murders are rare in Canada 
• Gary Kleck (1997). Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control. Transaction Publishers. p. 360. ISBN 978-0-202-36941-9. As in Great Britain, after Canada implemented its more stringent gun controls, its homicide rate advantage over the United ... therefore cannot conclude from such simple cross-national comparisons that stricter gun controls reduced violence 
• Gregg Lee Carter Ph.D. (2012). Guns in American Society. ABC-CLIO. p. 250. ISBN 978-0-313-38671-8. Historically, Canada has had stricter gun control legislation than the United States, as well as lower rates of criminal violence and a higher suicide rate 
• Jack Reynolds (2003). A People Armed and Free: The Truth About the Second Amendment. AuthorHouse. p. 233. ISBN 978-1-4107-4545-3. They point to other countries, such as Canada and Japan, that have strict gun control laws and much lower rates of shootings, asserting that gun control therefore must work to reduce violence 
• Constance Emerson Crooker (2003). Gun Control and Gun Rights. Greenwood Publishing Group. p. 5. ISBN 978-0-313-32174-0. Gun control proponents often point out that countries such as Great Britain and Canada, which have strong gun control laws also have lower rates of violent crime. 
• Patricia Cormack; James Cosgrave (2013). Desiring Canada. University of Toronto Press. p. 92. ISBN 978-1-4426-6330-5. 
• Joseph Heath; Andrew Potter (2010). The Rebel Sell: Why The Culture Can't Be Jammed. HarperCollins Canada. p. 200. ISBN 978-1-55468-918-7. 
• Jean Chretien (2010). My Years as Prime Minister. Knopf Canada. p. 209. ISBN 978-0-307-36872-0. 

--Moxy (talk) 15:40, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

Erotic film, magazine and web content

Culture encompasses representations of eroticism in the culture. Why would it not?{{unsigned|| — Preceding unsigned comment added by BetterThanSuchAsYou (talk • contribs) 18:05, 5 March 2014 (UTC)

I guess this person is referring to this and related removals...he does have a point. A lot of the porn industry features Canadian performers, and sex worker issues are a regular part of news/social issues coverage.....is it only prurience that says this doesn't belong in an article on teh national culture? "Culture" is such a difficult word, sometimes I feel like quoting Goerring on the subject because of all the ways it's used and misused....Skookum1 (talk) 04:15, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Since he put the question in this article's talk page, I would think that he is talking about this edit [1] Four different editors have removed the edit. So far there is no concensus that this material should be in the article, or that similar material should be in articles on the culture of other countries either. Meters (talk) 05:56, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

• I have no problem with porn being part of culture. In the broadest sense it is. I think my main objection to it being on this article is the specificity. Is this a particularly notable part of Canadian culture? Are Canadians renowned for their porn? I don't see how this is a particular instance of Canadian culture other that the fact that porn is produced in Canada. But I'm guessing it's pretty much produced everywhere. This article doesn't cover absolutely everything that's produced in Canada and I think it's a bit of undue weight to include it here, especially with the only source provided being a general study on the porn habits of men. freshacconci talk to me 15:18, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

The following is not a good addition here or replacing Oscar Peterson at the Canadians article anyone can see this. -- Moxy (talk) 17:07, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Legendary bisexual Canadian porn cock "woodsman" and auteur Peter North

LOL, yeah, duh......but at the same time Peter North is an example of how prominent Canadians are in the porn industry; to the point that he's actually something of a national icon within Canadian porn fans (not that I am one, I'm relaying what I've picked up from friends...original research I know); including Dorothy Stratten from long ago..... (Hugh Hefner's girlfriend from Coquitlam who was murdered).... how to put this in the article, and how to cite it, I don't know, but I do know that some of the largest porn producers/websites are Canadian owned/started and that for a long time Vancouver has been a very busy porn production centre, online and otherwise.Skookum1 (talk) 06:05, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

Best any into of this nature be in the Cinema of Canada. NO one when writing about Canadian culture talks about the porn industry as being a part of Canadian identity. As for "Peter North" in Canada the politician is more famous to the average person then this old porn star. As for Worldwide Pornography Revenues Canada is not even in the top ten - We make more money selling pot to the Americans. -- Moxy (talk) 20:34, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

Pornography doesn't belong in the Arts section. If it shall be included it must be treated as a social phenomena or similar. The edits by BetterThanSuchAsYou seems to make pornography more mainstream than it is. Regards, Iselilja (talk) 00:26, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

BTW: to suggest that pornography is part of Canadian government policy as it pertains to culture is ridiculous. The only government policies regarding pornography in Canada are about restrictions on content (eg - novice actors unaware of their circumstances being restrained during scenes) and its dissemination. The government or constitution do not specifically grant rights to owning pornographic material. They restrict rights on who can acquire it, and where. Mindmatrix 00:28, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

I didn't suggest that it was part of government policy, by no means; the confiscation and destruction of books imported by Little Sisters Bookstore in Vancouver is rather infamous as far as censorship goes. And since when did this article get defined by what is government cultural policy? Culture is not just a creature of federal funding (or you'd hope that's not all it is).Skookum1 (talk) 03:37, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

I wasn't referring to your comment, but rather the edit to the article that adds non-minor acquisition of porn in a sentence about government policies. Mindmatrix 03:44, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

There was a Canadian Press article today (March 7) this week saying that the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission will be investigating several X-rated cable TV channels for having insufficient Canadian content. So much for the argument that Canada is such a huge part of the porn world that porn needs to be considered a noteworthy part of the county's culture. Meters (talk) 00:41, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

National Post article link from Mar 5 http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/03/05/your-porn-is-not-canadian-enough-crtc-warns-erotica-channels/ Meters (talk) 00:59, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

That surprises me a bit, but on consideration it's a truism that a lot of porn industry work is under the table and the monies earned are quite probably kept in cash or offshore; so if a production is not registered as being Canadian by incorporation or tax reasons, it won't be acknowledged by the CRTC. Pretty funny that they're basically calling for more porn production so that "we" aren't only seeing foreign-made productions and foreign stars.Skookum1 (talk) 03:37, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ I have found some stuff (sources) as seen below ...can we do anything with it? Do we have the proper sources to make statements of a cultural nature? So lets look at the source that I can find!!!! What do others think - is porn a part of Canadian culture that needs representation here? Is it of political concern...as in a partisan topic that divides the parties? Is it a main concern in the courts? -- Moxy (talk) 17:06, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

• William H. New (2002). Encyclopedia of Literature in Canada. University of Toronto Press. p. 187. ISBN 978-0-8020-0761-2. 
• Dany Lacombe (1994). Blue Politics: Pornography and the Law in the Age of Feminism. University of Toronto Press. p. 75. ISBN 978-0-8020-7352-5. 
• Lance W. Roberts; Rodney A. Clifton; Barry Ferguson (2005). Recent Social Trends in Canada, 1960-2000. McGill-Queen's Press. p. 515. ISBN 978-0-7735-7314-7. 
• Thomas Waugh (2006). Romance of Transgression in Canada: Queering Sexualities, Nations, Cinemas. McGill-Queen's Press. p. 242. ISBN 978-0-7735-7680-3. 
• Dr Yaman Akdeniz (2013). Internet Child Pornography and the Law: National and International Responses. Ashgate Publishing, Ltd. p. 152. ISBN 978-1-4094-9607-6. 

Saw this at ANI - it's not really theirs to fix, though. IMHO the topic of pornography should be mentioned, and perhaps its limitation by the ban on child pornography (giving a chance to link that article) but only briefly in the "Media" section. There's no sense in setting it up as a social phenomenon apart from other sorts of film. And the total amount of text given to it should be very low - this article is an overall summary of the entire culture, after all, and there are specific articles for detailing all these little bits and pieces. Ideally, we should just barely alert the reader that porn is discussed in Media in Canada, and the reader should click on that article and get something more like this section. The caveat being that that article doesn't contain the word porn, strangely, so I'd say send this section there, give it a wring to deal with some issues (moderately POV wording, and the BLP implications of putting a guy's picture under a main article: child pornography in canada template) and you should be good to go. Wnt (talk) 17:48, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

@Wnt question about ANI reply "it's not really theirs to fix". Where should one go when we have a disruptive editor that seems not understand consensus and not talking to use while we are try to figure out what should or should not be said? On a side note need to work on the Pornography in Canada article as it does not help our readers at all with no content or sources etc. -- Moxy (talk) 18:24, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

I didn't see the 3RR breach but someone there apparently did and "blocked them for a few days". I'm surprised they did anything, but in any case, I doubt it will be the end of the argument. Wnt (talk) 20:01, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

Query: I just looked on the main ANI board, I don't see it though do see a listing of deleted titles concerning porn. Which board is the item mentioned above on? Curious as to what whomever is saying. Surprising to me the paucity of material on Pornography in Canada, given the amount of news coverage on various aspects of this, and also the numerous (if not overwhelmingly so) notable Canadians who are porn actors or otherwise engaged in the industry, is surprising; the Little Sisters Bookstore case should be mentioned there in the passage about the Border Services Agency; the case was a long time ago but seminal in Canadian pornography and human rights law.Skookum1 (talk) 07:07, 9 March 2014 (UTC)

McMaster University Wikipedia Visiting Scholar position

Of possible interest to editors of this article: McMaster University is accepting applications for a Wikipedia Visiting Scholars position with a possible focus on popular culture in Canada. Through the Visiting Scholars program, educational institutions provide experienced Wikipedians with remote access to their libraries' research resources. The Wikipedian is given an official university login and agrees to create/improve articles on Wikipedia in a subject area of mutual interest. The positions are unpaid, remote, and usually go for 6 or 12 months. If you have at least 1000 edits, an account at least 1 year old, and experience improving content, you're eligible. For more information see Wikipedia:Visiting Scholars. Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 15:25, 28 July 2015 (UTC)

✓ update: position filled. feel free to archive/remove. --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 15:56, 1 December 2015 (UTC)

One-sided article

I find this article to be belligerently biased toward U.S. cultural imperialism.

Way too much speculative language is used to "validate" the implicit uselessness of Canada's attempt to produce, promote, and reinforce Canadian content in an era of U.S.-dominated media. Almost everything in the article reads as a reaction to the United States. For instance, why do the film, media, and television sections speak of Canadian English-language content as if it were inconsequential (or even nonessential) to Anglo Canadians? I mean, the inference here is that this content would not exist at all without the CBC or the CRTC regulations, in turn propagating the falsehood that Anglo Canadians by nature are uninterested in if not lack artistic expression (and therefore require their UK and U.S. neighbours to provide them with some form of culture for them to consume). In reality, there is a great deal of Canadian television available in English, and Canadian media is substantially different from its U.S. counterpart, particularly in news reporting, which should warrant inclusion in this article. Oh, and what about the influence of Canada on the U.S. (and world culture[s])?

As well, problematic wording is rampant throughout. For instance, the subsection concerning identity reads:

[T]he issue of Canadian identity remains under scrutiny, perhaps more than the identity of the people of any other modern nation.

The word "perhaps" is problematic here because it is elusive rather than encyclopedic. Has a formal study been undertaken to justify such a claim? There is no question that Canadian identity has always been under scrutiny, yes, but framing it within the context of "modern nations" (by the way, what does modern even mean to the reference's author?) only serves to perpetuate stereotypes and surely mockery rather than foster a deeper understanding of Canadian sensibilities.

There is still a laundry list of other issues. Where is the section on the culturally celebrated RCMP uniform? How about the traditional music styles of Acadia, Cape Breton Island, Nova Scotia proper, Newfoundland, and Quebec? Why are endemic Canadian foods given limited coverage? Why is multiculturalism, a phenomenon that began in the mid-1970s, treated as if it has always defined Canada? I could go on for hours.

This article is currently a piece of propaganda and requires heavy restructuring. 216.191.43.98 (talk) 17:53, 20 September 2015 (UTC)